Two Guys Arguing

March Lambda Lounge

Posted in lambdalounge by youngnh on 03.06.09

4th ever Lambda Lounge meeting happened last night, and even though I had to leave early, there was plenty going on to like so I wanted to spill some of my impressions quickly this morning. This meeting gets cooler and cooler every month. Appistry provides beer (as in free) and pizza (I had a slice with Doritos, jalapenos and pepperoni, changed my view of things) and next month the Lounge covers Factor and the long-awaited Parrot VM.  The month after that will behold a language shootout, all topics upholding the upward trend. (thanks for the correction, Alex!)

Ken Sipe opened the night with an introduction to F#. Ken mentioned that this was his first LL, but he’s obviously done the presenting thing before. His talk was a smooth sweep of the F# language. A couple of things he said rang particularly true:

  • F# is going to be big. As far as functional programming goes, most languages have power, but very few have the deep reach to actually touch developers at their desks. F# has tooling, Microsoft support and upcoming first class inclusion into the .NET platform.

Say what you want about Microsoft, but the C# language has continually impressed with a flexibility and forward progression that Java doesn’t feel like its generating anymore. With F# on the horizon and Mono making it possible to work with .NET in Linux, a lot of functional programmers may be looking Redmond’s way in the very near future.

  • F# reduces noise on the signal that syntax descended from C tends to introduce.

Ken had a couple of great slides that illustrated that if nothing else, functional programming allows the programmer to express ideas with little structure, braces, etc. surrounding them. F# source is a compressed package of the data you are working on, the operations you are performing and little else. On this point, the Ruby community’s sense of aesthetics — that something functional should be short and expressive — has made all programmers look at their production code and increased all of our appetites for terseness. Until now, our languages have been making our fingers do work, and as far as IDEs and autocomplete have come, F# really brings programmers down closer to the ideas they are expressing.

  • F#’s discriminated unions and pattern matching are killer.

These complementary features allow for a style of programming that is expressive and beautiful and instantly readable. Discriminated unions make disparate data simple to break down into component parts and associate with an overarching type. Pattern matching allows a function to introspect as deep into a type as it wants, as well as pick and choose cases to implement functionality with. Long branching if chains and switch statements have no reason for existence in F#. Ken’s exact quote was “we need this”.

It was lighthearted and exploratory. For those who know monads, Michael talked about the Maybe monad. For those of you who don’t, he stressed that monads aren’t something that you can impart knowledge of on someone else by force of will, but that everyone has to struggle with and learn for themselves. For his part on our journey, though, Easter brought props! He used a coozie, a water bottle, a two-foot length of cardboard tube, and maybe there was more, I don’t know, I had to leave after his first example of making a beverage by adding water, hops and malt. :)

Michael’s code was in Haskell and it made an excellent companion to Ken’s F# introduction as both languages share a common heritage and similar syntax. Until this is our jobs and we hate looking at Haskell or F# as much as we hate looking at Java, this is all strange and weird and promising and Easter captured that in his words, slides and examples. A lot of people asked a lot of questions at the end of Ken’s talk. I imagine the situation was similar after Michael’s. The functional space is huge, F# is only a tiny part. Monads are only a tiny part. This is certainly early-adopter territory. As many questions asked about F# were observations on various other aspects of functional programming people had encountered. This is the current spirit of the Lambda Lounge. Almost like a bunch of spies reporting back to each other on super top-secret new weapons. Until all of this is clear, the Lounge is a great place to trade intel.

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4 Responses

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  1. benjaminplee said, on 03.06.09 at 4:34 pm

    Dang. I am really bummed I had to miss it. I was half hoping you would say “meeting was crap, wished I hadn’t gone” but not really. Glad to hear it continued the upward trend.

  2. Alex Miller said, on 03.06.09 at 4:48 pm

    Thanks for the write-up! Great stuff.

    Actually, next month at the April meeting we will have talks on Factor and Parrot, both excessively cool topics in my humble opinion. The May meeting will be the language shootout.

  3. zac said, on 03.06.09 at 6:49 pm

    You’re right about c# vs java. Moving from c# 3 to java 6 was like getting in a time machine and going backwards for several years. I really hope I get a chance to work with f# here in the future.

  4. Michael Easter said, on 03.08.09 at 3:38 am

    +1 on thanks for the write-up!

    Re: Lambda Lounge, I love, love, love the last lines about spies trading intel on new weapons. That is perfect and right on the money. I feel like LL is a legion of superheroes, in a way. I don’t think I, or anyone person, is a superhero, but when congregated, I get that vibe.


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